What do you want from a melee AI update?

[:1]We've been told melee heroes are due for some AI updating love. I don't know if that will happen, since I thought it was coming with the 7 hero update, but we shall see.

I use melee heroes a lot and I don't have a lot of complaints unlike most people it seems. Here are a couple of my complaints or addressing others:

Fleeing AoE This should be conditional. As it is, heroes will flee AoE as soon as the recognize they're in it. That leads to them fleeing things they shouldn't, like firestorm when they have Shielding Hands on them and 146 armor.

This needs to be conditional instead, if you're taking X% of total health damage from AoE, leave. That gets Koss out of Savannah Heat and Meteor Shower (can we add this to AoE behavior?) but let's him sit in Firestorm and kill the enemy monk, because there is no downside to doing so.

Some AoE conditions could be addressed like Eruption, Churning Earth, or Unsteady Ground: Even if you aren't taking X% damage, get out of Eruption and UG, but stay in Churning Earth because you have FB! on you.

Who they are targeting Pathing issues should be obvious, if you're suffering from them, don't fight things in a valley when you're on top of the ridge and have warriors with you. This could be addressed in the AI by saying "if you can't get to your target in 5 seconds or less, don't go there", but it's better for the player to just not be retarded or flag the hero to a safe place.

Heroes will attack what you attack to a fault. If you're spreading conditions or looking for interrupts as a ranger, Koss will be zigzagging across the battlefield like a PCP fiend. Heroes should attack what you call unless you tell them not to (i.e. putting Gwen on aggressive when she has a lot of interrupts, she'll ignore your called target if it isn't casting). I generally find heroes follow this so I do not have problems with my melee heroes running around like decapitate chickens.

What they're using I.e., nothing. Melee heroes suffer from a severe lack of using skills. A DB Zenmai will use her combo, and in a relatively timely manner, contrary to popular belief. The problem is, her DPS is atrocious because she is autoattacking every other hit at best. Koss will sit around autoattacking with fully charged adrenaline skills.

What I want is: If a melee hero has the resources to use a skill, they use it immediately and repeatedly. Spam adrenaline skills, spam attack chains. This is the deal breaker for most people with melee heroes IMO.

IASs Good luck coming up with a formula for when to use Flail or Frenzy; even players struggle with that. The other IASs either have no downsides (Heart of Fury), complicated downsides (Burst of Aggression) or don't exist (sins). Don't bring Tiger Stance if you're fighting a lot of Naga.

Hexes Credit CHIPS: Stop swinging when Koss has hexes like SS or Empathy. Hello team wipe, meet SS + Koss and his anger problem.

So what do you want from a hypothetical melee AI update?|||Heros should stop swinging when they got hexes like Empathy on them. Mobs should stop swinging after a while too; Not just before they die.|||Quote:








Heros should stop swinging when they got hexes like Empathy on them. Mobs should stop swinging after a while too; Not just before they die.




This is an excellent, excellent point. I'm going to add this to my list with credit to you; I didn't think of it because I usually bring a lot of hex removal.. Many/most people don't realize how a few of the right hexes can stop any team in it tracks. Empathy DESTROYS an overpowered physical team, even the old crit scythe sin.|||One update I would like to see is in the use of Aggressive Refrain by para heroes. They cast it on recharge as soon as they have enough energy to do so, even if Aggressive Refrain is already up because it was maintained by shouts. So they end up running into battle with almost zero energy, unable to use any skills, since their adrenaline isn't up yet either.

I wouldn't mind seeing some caster hero updates at well. Stop casting Splinter Weapon on other heroes set to avoid combat just because they're carrying a physical weapon. (I like giving caster spears to my healing monks, but it is very irritating to see Splinter being wasted on them.) Do cast Splinter Weapon and other combat buffs on pets.|||Well 1) I sort of agree about AR but I disable it and end of problem, and 2) none of those suggestions have anything at all to do with melee AI.|||I want a "stand your ground" option for heroes so that I could run a tank build on one and nukes on the rest.|||Quote:








Hello team wipe, meet SS + Koss and his anger problem.




They don't need an introduction, they've already met...

Anyway, more clever (as in not pants on head retarded) melee heroes, or physical heroes in general actually, would be nice. As you mention, actually using skills when they can be used is a good idea (but possibly one which would make heroes better than most human players), as is smarter movement.|||Quote:








Heros should stop swinging when they got hexes like Empathy on them. Mobs should stop swinging after a while too; Not just before they die.




Honestly, I would rather have them kill themselves if one is unable to remove such hexes than to stop attacking (or better yet, stop once it's health drops under a certain number - I'd say 100ish).

Especially since prots (or broken huge heals) can negate all damage taken that way.



And while we are at it - they should look into ranged AI attacking through walls.

Go grab a bunch of ranged attackers (or casters that require a line of sight for their spells) and take the to the Avatar of Melandru's fortress. I almost deleted my paragon after witnessing that piece of fail.|||Death is the best way to remove hex and condition stacks.

Thinking about this, I'm not sure how successful an update to melee AI would be. I was going to say that frontline roles demand a certain amount of decision making to be successful, possibly decisions that are too are too complex for AI... but then I remembered that it doesn't actually matter that much, at least in PvE.

My bugbear with frontline AI is that if you are playing say, something that isn't wanding all the time, they start to run around like headless chickens, from the target back to you - even if set to aggressive. If a target it called, they should go after it until you either flag them back, or call a new target. The running back and forth thing is not ideal at all and could use a fix.|||Quote:








What they're using I.e., nothing. Melee heroes suffer from a severe lack of using skills. A DB Zenmai will use her combo, and in a relatively timely manner, contrary to popular belief. The problem is, her DPS is atrocious because she is autoattacking every other hit at best. Koss will sit around autoattacking with fully charged adrenaline skills.

What I want is: If a melee hero has the resources to use a skill, they use it immediately and repeatedly. Spam adrenaline skills, spam attack chains. This is the deal breaker for most people with melee heroes IMO.




Yes, please.